He just put NFT [crosstalk 01:40:26] for sale. And theoretically, you're not supposed to be able to...Say if you're a hacker go in and hack Coinbase or something and steal a bunch of Bitcoin. But the technology behind it enables basically many, many copies of that spreadsheet to exist and they all kind of talk to each other and compare to each other. Beeple: It's counting down. So yeah, I would just look at it like, "Okay, chill out. The entire crypto market right now is I want to say 30 million, 50 million, whatever. What would you sell right now? This is a good investment." Does it feel different to be paid as Beeple the artist versus Beeple the freelancer who makes art shit. So, then I was very much all in on this thing. Parents, everybody's waiting at the thing. Joey: So, to me, that piece of it, I think potentially, they'll move to make that cross-platform in the future, maybe. It's a scam, blah, blah, blah, blah." I don't really give a fuck about the [NFT 01:25:08] crypto part of it, that part of it's there making it more valuable and sort of backing it up. [crosstalk 01:15:37] Yeah. Dec 6, 2016 - Explore Richard Gladstone's board "mike winkelmann" on Pinterest. The biggest thing is if a Ethereum goes down ad Bitcoin and that crash, which they tend to sort of like peaks and valleys. Because right now, to enjoy digital art, you have to go to Instagram, you have to choose to do it. Joey: That's a good weekend. The reason Sotheby's sells things for more than eBay is because anybody can put something on eBay. But I think as the space matures, again, I could be wrong, I think it will be more seen. So, that was auctioned off the next day, and both of those auction pieces went for $66,000. But it's sort of a proof of ownership attached to a piece of artwork. Beeple: Okay. I could be out of their life so easily, just stop looking at it. Take your shirt off and sing me a fucking song. It's another crypto currency. You talked to a lot of people in this space and stuff like that, and I'd like to know, was there any talk about... Just from an outsider's perspective, it seems like there's a certain aesthetic that collectors really are going for. I almost think that phase of cryptoartists, I never really liked, because it's almost like you're drawing a line in the sand and you're being exclusionary. So, again, these things can change because the token can point to a file, it points to a video file, but it could also point to a different video file. It doesn't really matter what they pay you in. Again, I have a computer science degree. What happens when he croaks? Beeple: Does that make sense? Beeple: I think it will be just like prints moving forward. Does that make sense? And they had different properties of how fast they procreated and what like different personalities they had. Yeah, so what do you think brings the value though? He's the guy that owns it because of NFTs. It's funny because if someone's going to pay you for a sponsored post, maybe that kind of turns them off when you do stuff like that, but as a crypto artist it's like... Do you now feel like, "Huh, maybe I should go even crazier, or maybe I should tone it back?" He works with a wide range of visual materials, from illustrations to films, but what we would like to show you is impressive and pretty unique. And I want to put some of that money into collecting art. Beeple: But nothing's a guarantee or it wouldn't be [inaudible 00:15:13]. So I think it's something that I would be aware of. I don't understand. I mean, I saw this stuff and I was like, "Okay. That being said, there are options to sell this stuff. Well, I didn't even fucking make any money because the gas fees were so much, and the piece sold for X amount of dollars." Nobody else thinks you own the file. So it's basically, that's a bit in the weeds, all from the like looking at it sort of like from the Bitcoin perspective, the only reason Bitcoin has value is because you can't just copy Bitcoin. You can buy it. And so if you have that token in your wallet, you own it. I wouldn't get too hung up on that piece of it. Think of it as pesos or some other type of... Just not dollars, because it could literally instantly be converted to dollars. So that's where the NFT, it's their sort of like providing extra value in the background and you don't really need to understand the logistics of that piece of it. This big celebrity is going to be selling, like Dead Mouse is selling songs on there and stuff like that. And I truly think this is the beginning of people looking at digital artwork as quote unquote real art because we take for granted now, you know, I go back to Cause and Banksy and that. Better known as. From abstract blobs of metallic goo to fully-realized science fiction landscapes, Winkelmann shares every creation he makes in an uninterrupated st, Based in Wisconsin, Mike Winkelmann, better known under the pseudonym Beeple, challenged himself to design a new image every day using his talents for photo ret, BEEPLE is Mike Winkelmann. So I think there's just a lot of advantages that the blockchain provides over the traditional art market, but then when you also pair it with the physical pieces, you kind of get the best of both worlds. What the fuck?" If I'm trying to make money one way or another, this is the most high leverage thing you can do. Joey: Beeple: Mike Winkelmann, also known as Beeple, is a graphic designer from Appleton, Wisconsin, USA. Justin Roiland. They kind of hide all that functionality. As soon as the thing goes on sale, the site crashes. So, to my knowledge, it's the same on Known Origin or any of these other platforms, that they can kind of remove it from the system, and then you will not get that 10%. We're used to, like, you are able to copy anything and reproduce it a million times. EJ: Beeple: Instead of having a bunch of toys or a bunch of vinyl collectibles on your desk, you'll have a bunch of these video screens, and this is your video collection. Yep. EJ: So what is, and you can be pretty brief, but I'm curious, like, okay, so you put your artwork up, someone buys it. Thank you very much for coming on to curse and tell us stories about what has just happened to you. And it's been growing for the last roughly two years. I assumed you were doing more of that than [inaudible 01:00:50]. So, the time of the drop came. People don't know that. Got it. So, I was definitely like, "Holy..." $66,000 each. So I know that for the listener, I know this is all like a bit technical, but I think it's kind of important to wrap your head around it because the technicality of it is what actually allows for sort of proof of ownership of a digital asset, which previously it was kind of a really alien concept and I've become a little more comfortable with it recently after watching Beeple go through his experience, but also I bought a Gmunk NFT the other day. I don't like it. They're like, "This is going to be around for two months, and I got to fucking get mine now, because fuck it." We didn't know about this. Kind of in preparation for this. "No." Joey: And Ethereum, the difference between a theory of, and Bitcoin is Ethereum allows you to sort of like add programming to the coins. They could have been attached to any type of art. Now Beeple came to the space, then the next bigger person will come to the space and then the next fricking person will come to the space. So I realize it could be offensive, but that's never my intention. [inaudible 00:22:49] four times. So it's amazing. Yeah. Oh, this is what everybody's doing," but I think the more you can stand out, the more it will actually benefit you, versus trying to fit in. There was a lot more hype around it because I just have more people following my work. So, I talked to them, and it was like, oh, as I was talking to them, we were talking about a piece that sold Christies about a month before that, and it had an NFT attached to a sculpture, and it changed based on where the sculpture was in the world. I made $16,000. It's hypercompetitive. That's not the fucking real thing.". So, in that weekend I made about $130,000, and those pieces, the pieces that I made, were pieces that took me about two days, two to three days, because again, the whole thing came together right before the auction. I thought it'd be maybe somewhere between 10 and 100 bucks, because again, it's one of 100, so it's like, okay, well, how much is it really worth? EJ: I don't know what the fuck you want. I don't know how the hell it can fall in a pile of piss. So yeah, that's where I think it's a very exciting, exciting time. He has proven the value of digital work beyond anything seen before...and he's just getting started. They might actually make sense for that, but some of the people it's like, "Okay, this does not seem like it's worth your time." And so that brings up another thing you mentioned, which was NFT because obviously the artwork that you're selling and other artists are selling as crypto art, the file itself, the image or the video that can be copy pasted and have a million copies. Programmable art, Async art, [Mettaverses 00:24:37], there's so much shit. A Beeple, and everybody understands what the fuck it is. So, that is definitely a factor in the fees, and something that you could deduct. And some people bought it and I was like, "Wow, that was cool." And I don't think they're going to start explaining what this is until there's more money there because right now, it wouldn't make sense for Justin Bieber to do that. Okay, sweet. How do I get away with the IP stuff, or the weird, gross, disgusting shit? So I think continuing to concentrate on being the best artist designer or this or that I think, that didn't change magically overnight here. When someone bought my thing, I got 1.5 Ethereum, which equaled out at that time to be maybe $1,000, and I was just like, "Holy crap. Joey: Yeah. I could have sold that, but now that I've sold the 4,798th Everyday for a hundred thousand dollars, now how much do you think the first Everyday is worth? Again, after the first job, I got a bunch of questions. So, now people have these $1 of 100, and they could immediately resell them to somebody else who didn't get them, like we didn't, but wants them. Beeple: That's why I was so excited about it, because it was like, "Oh man, I can think of so many artists who I would love to have in something like this, and so that I could just see their art and have it be a part of my life passively." "Mike Winkelmann never used to call himself an artist. And they're all making sure like, okay, are we all like, this is all legit? Maybe somebody will buy it, and maybe they won't. But for simplicity sake, it's basically just a proof of ownership, an NFT is a proof of ownership, a token on the blockchain that says you own this file. Beeple: EJ: And if that happens, you'll deal with it and maybe I go back to client work, maybe I do whatever, but concentrating on fundamentals of making good images and making work that speaks to you. Beeple: We are literally made of questions, so let's sit down with the man himself. So, just to kind of throw that out there. Like first it's this new thing. [crosstalk 01:28:35] on the physical pieces. They maybe are selling the work of 20 to 30 artists a month versus Rareable, there's 10,000 pieces of art for sale today, or 100,000 or whatever. This kind of opens up everything to anyone that can, well, I guess almost anyone, as long as you can get accepted to one of these sites, and that's kind of a subject we can talk about a little bit later on, but as far as me and what I've seen through Twitter and stuff like that, people are self-defeatist. It's not like I'm going to change the style, and I wouldn't recommend doing that. And really, when I bought it, I wanted to do it so that I could kind of just experience what the whole process is like and try to get inside the head of these collectors. You know? Well, yeah. But if you know, like new collectors come into the space, much like Joey buying Gmunk stuff like Joey, would you have thought prior to this, that you would pay Gmunk, what'd you 500 bucks for one of his MP4s? and you say, "Okay," and they pay you for the picture, and they decide what the picture is, and you draw them their picture, and that to me is a designer. Yeah. I have to disagree that objectively in my eyes at least there is no objectively bad art. I don't know that for sure, but I would guess that's the case. r/beeple: BEEPLE is mike winkelmann. What's an NFT? I think as it becomes more mainstream, nobody's really going to give a shit about that piece of it. CGI master Winkelmann has been creating one illustration a day from start to finish for the last 10+ years. But the more you can concentrate and listen to that voice, the more you will do work that... People see that passion, and they see that you really fucking gave a shit about what you were creating, and it will resonate with them. Yeah. What the fuck?" So it's sort of like, if you're suddenly, sort of like, "Oh, here's a Beeple," and it's like, "Well, do you have the token?" And that's another thing of the fear based view of this whole thing. I didn't know shit about crypto. Most of it, I know I not going to sell, and so moving forward, I'm going to do a spring collection and a fall collection. So just like violent video games, or rap music, or dirty comedians, or this or that, raunchy jokes or whatever, is not for everybody. Gas fees are... Nifty includes that in their 20%, so that's something that they, again... Because they're a little different. I follow the Cryptoart hashtag on Twitter and stuff like that, and I see people getting super emotional when they sell their first piece of art because it's like this breakthrough for them as far as a mindset where it's like, you think your work is worthless and no one likes what you do, but wow, is that just turned upside-down on its head when you see someone paid $1,000 for a looping gif or something like that. Like that's not possible. Going back again to Banksy, how many Banksy prints are out there? I didn't know shit. Is that a Beeple?" So if you want to buy the post, you can just buy the post and then it will show you are the person who owns that picture. So, you're kind of working towards the same goal, versus with a client, this might sound bad, but high-level, just high-level market dynamics, you're trying to get the most amount of money for the least amount of work, and they're trying to get the most amount of work for the least amount of money. You don't want to have all your chips in one stock or whatever. It's pretty much their fault. You don't own it. Again, you also have the tokens. A new picture made from start to finish by Mike every single day. I've put in these sort of markers that nobody knows about that only I know about to sort of make sure they are... That I can tell, like, "Nah, that's not fucking real.". Just like I don't give a fucking shit about how credit cards work. That this is something that I spent 13 years doing this cryptoart, or this phase. Yeah, so you should probably see a doctor about that by the way. It's sort of like, "Okay, well, this is a way to use, to collect, digital artwork. Yeah. Beeple: People just disappeared. You trying to get a Beeple?" It's just some fucking splatters on the fucking canvas. Who gives a shit?" But that was sort of the very first like NFT. I have art all over my house, but it's like posters and stuff like, you know, it's like I'll spend a hundred bucks on something, but for a, essentially an MP4, no. And yeah, that's really all it is. So, let's get into some of the, I guess, mindset stuff around this, because I think fine artists and maybe even illustrators, there are certain kinds of designers that have probably been exposed to selling your art way before motion designers really become used to this. And you can say you were the only person who owns that. It's not whatever Ethereum is that day, that's what it is. The more true and honest you are with what you want to see, and what you want to make, and you are really passionate about creating, I try and listen to that voice. So, I think it is a viable investment. Mar 24, 2020 - Fiverr freelancer will provide Logo Animation services and make custom hollywood movie intro including Background Music within 2 days Beeple: Beeple: And so the early collectors and a lot of the collectors now still too, will put up a significant amount of money. The influencer stuff dropped off, I'll say that. Joey: Like, that's really easy. And every investment is part speculation, part like, okay, fundamentals of investing market dynamics, blah, blah, blah. What emotions did you go through when... Was your first one that big drop where you sold a few pieces? But from the what understood, like what makes it sort of decentralized is that somehow every computer that's like part of this blockchain is sort of, I guess like checking it against other competitors and saying, hey, do we have the same information? I think it might be that celebrity is going to be this thing to draw more eyes that maybe people weren't paying attention to Cryptoart before, but maybe now just your people that are scrolling through Instagram, just your everyday people that don't even maybe know what motion design is, is going to look at these sites and be like, "Ooh, I want to buy that like." EJ: This is going to be around for a second." All Rights to Mike Winkelmann, For over 9 years, graphic designer and digital artist Mike Winkelmann (aka Beeple) has endeavored to create a new digital illustration every single day. What makes something valuable? It's not a bit speculative. That's it. He's got the token. So, within 45 minutes, somebody resold that thing that they paid $1 for for $1,000. So that's kind of what I looked at it. and then reached out to different artists in this space, reached out to collectors in this space, just trying to understand anybody who would hop on a Zoom call with me and chat for 30 minutes, "What the hell is going on here? I bought a small amount of crypto in 2017 through Coinbase. Now we're seeing those skills kind of tip. It's just, basically, it's more like digital gold. EJ: And so it just so happens too, and that's where I feel super lucky, it just so happens that they decided to speculate on exactly what we make. How does it relate to cryptocurrency and blockchain and all that stuff? It's worth something because other people want it and they think it's worth something. A hundred percent. So I'm not looking at this. Beeple: I sure as hell wouldn't. Who the fuck knows. It is and it isn't. Yeah. If you don't do all those things, then I do not believe it will be a way that you just magically make a bunch more money is what I would guess will happen with the sort of like market dynamics over the long run. So, you know what I mean? Of course nobody would have said, "Yeah, no, people are really going to want to see that. I mean, I got paid in Ethereum for my first piece that I sold, and-. It's like, "Really?" You can't just say, oh, I've got a Bitcoin now copy paste. Do you just kind of want to do this now? Beeple: Yeah. I own the file, I own the token. So go back to that. Joey: And if that's not the case, then you won't. Summary: Ralph Winkelmann is 87 years old today because Ralph's birthday is on 07/01/1933. Beeple: Almost nobody can put something on Sotheby's. Let's do this thing." Joey: Way to go. So, if somebody has one of 100 and somebody has two of 100 and somebody has 69 of 100 and somebody has 100 of 100, so that matters too in the value of these. And the main difference, not the main difference. In December of that year, he held an auction to see what a small selection of his dailies were worth...and the results were revolutionary. If not, something's been changed. That's not the case for all of them. So that is partially why that is that whoever did that has probably been around in this space longer than you and they've built up a name in this space with the collectors. So, somebody got to keep $5,400 that night on something they just paid $1 on five hours earlier. These are all concepts that people need to think about when they're looking at releasing their art, and how to do that. The American Legion Dayton Memorial Post 512 celebrated the 100th birthday of The American Legion (1919-2019) at their regularly convened monthly meeting Tuesday, March 19. So I was like, "Okay." There's not much more to it. ... not just you sold it once, and now that's all you're going to get. So, the night of the drop comes, and these all have very specific times. That's why I feel so, so lucky because it's the art. So, does it feel different, though? How are you kind of looking at your career now in light of this? I rest my case. Yeah. Like, it seems crazy that, you know, I think it was like an Australian VC fund bought one of your pieces for $66,000 or something like that. Beeple: Does that make sense? Digital artist Mike Winkelmann, also known as Beeple, recently sold a $6.6 million video artwork on Nifty Gateway, a virtual marketplace for NFTs. Personally, I do not believe it's going to be viewed as cryptoart. Beeple: This specific painting is almost an exact copy of another person's painting, that is the Simpsons ripping off the Sergeant Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club, that album art. While I think this phase could be a huge thing moving forward, it's only the last three months of my career, and I don't know where it's going. I was like, this thing is stupid. All right. I know I'm going to try and sell, to be honest, keep it one to 2 percent of the Everydays. And I honestly think that that's how it will be with digital video. I was like, "Dude, what the fuck is going on with this?" I'm going to do... At least right now, my mindset is to do the Everydays until I die. Beeple: But as far as like you, your crypto art or fuck Render's crypto art, you know, it's like, we have our view in our motion design bubble of like who we think do amazing work and who who we think maybe doesn't do as great amount of work. His stuff, his name's Jerry, he was the first 2D artist that I actually saw on some of these platforms. Thank you. He's actually a crypto artist. [crosstalk 01:25:58] if something happens to it, you're fucked. Okay. Yeah. The more I've learned about them, the more I see Ethereum as just like any other tech company. Beeple: And it's all for like $16,000 or something like that. Moving forward now that we're in 2021, looking at what pieces will become part of the spring collection... Again, I'm probably not going to put any Trump shit in there. So, it was like, oh, shit. It just makes the fuck on your desk look sweeter. There's a reason the term starving artist exists. Even that-, EJ: And they're like, okay, we'll compute that onto the blockchain. Joey: I mean, to be honest, my favorite stuff that you make is the stuff that it's almost hard to look at. I thought you were going to say, "I think the same thing about your work.". No one's going to give me Monopoly money for any of my garbage work." So, he was nice enough to chat with me for a couple hours and sort of explain and give me a little onboarding into what the fuck this space is about. Is it going to take celebrity to make this whole Cryptoart selling, buying thing more mainstream as mainstream as people being on Instagram?